Lander blue? Apache? Verascite? Chinese?

Sold to me as Lander Blue with no provenance - it’s different for sure wondering opinions I have actual lander I don’t think this is but you never know

Under light the matrix is brown
It’s extremely tight micro

Betting not Lander Blue since no provenance, and because it’s one of the rarest turquoise of all. There’s waaaaay more supposed Lander Blue online for sale than was actually mined.

If it was minty green (I can’t tell from the pics for sure) I might wonder about Chalcosiderite. Possibly Chinese. I’m not as familiar with Apache Blue, but I see some online with tight webbing. It’s a lovely squash.

Without actual provenance, it will only be educated guesses.

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@cpark15 Welcome! That’s a nice squash blossom necklace. My guess is the stones may be either a variscite or Chinese turquoise. Lots of both on the market these days with many beautiful colors to choose from.
ETA: Is the necklace hallmarked?


thanks! no hallmark
Processing: 2A4427BA-B1A1-4AF3-851A-5718D31282D3.jpeg…

It was listed as Old Pawn Lander - I know the mine was not discovered until the 70s, was trying to figure out when Hallmarking Artist began seems around same time frame or so

@cpark15 Looks like you may have tried to post an additional photo but, it didn’t come through.

Not to be a pain, but when someone lists something as “old pawn” without proof of that (pawn ticket, and even that doesn’t prove it’s old), I would not be sure of anything they claim. Regardless, it’s very pretty.


You’re not being a pain but old pawn is kind of a nomenclature for old patina’d native silver without a hallmark more than anything to me, I do not anticipate an old pawn receipt from the 60s or 70s and thats not the norm in Santa Fe where I buy items in person. This is my first piece from ebay and I am likely going to return it even though I love it because I believe it may have been sold under false advert. I have requested authenticating info well see if she gives thanks, C

Gotcha. I have pawn (not old pawn) tickets from stores I shopped at in AZ and NM, and old pawn is an actual thing that is now often misused, so the advertising term can be misleading. I am aware that it is being used now to sell items, but that doesn’t negate it’s true meaning to many members of this forum; guess I’m more of a purist on this issue than some people. And I think true old pawn would be prior to the 60’s.

It’s a pretty squash, but if you think it was misrepresented, I totally get returning it.


I’ve recently thought my buckle was original Lander Blue. After researching I found mine was Blue Winds. That being said, the Lander Blue I have since seen has a black matrix and the blue really pops. Also it seems original LB was used in very high quality pieces. IMHO the workmanship is not the highest quality. I see unfinished areas and solder pools. I would also expect to see all 100% hand made beads. And for $3.5k I would like an artist and some provenance. Could it be New Lander?


I think @StevesTrail may right about the stones being New Lander. Which, I believe, is a variscite out of NV. (Though, I’ve seen “New Lander Turquoise” used online.)


Agree with you, @StevesTrail. What you said combined with the fast and loose use (IMO) of “old pawn” says 1) seller doesn’t really know what Lander Blue is (maybe just looked it up online - Chinese stones can really imitate LB) and it’s an honest mistake, or 2) seller is deliberately misrepresenting the turquoise. Of course I could be wrong about it, but without provenance there’s no proof anyway.

I wondered about New Lander, but that seems to have a minty shade along with blue; couldn’t quite tell if these stones have that from the pictures. But whatever, then it’s still misrepresented, and we are still making educated guesses :grin:

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It will be a cold day somewhere otherwise warm before I buy turquoise sold as Lander Blue without provenance. As far as I’m concerned that gives you your answer right there. Also, I’m not an expert at identifying Lander, but this doesn’t look right at all to me. The blue is too sky colored, not deep enough. It also looks to have a crack in the main stone.


I purchased lander blue with provenance that will be here in a couple days, that should give me my final comparison point. I love the necklace but all the points well taken I doubt its lander blue. I asked for hefty discount on the necklace if they don’t want to do full refund, thx

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Its not the right greenish blue for new lander, it is a dark/medium blue, I thought that was possible but the color is not a match!


Please do post your provenanced LB, and the provenance itself. We’d love to see it.

One has to have a super high degree of confidence in the provenance for any and all things offered as LB, and zero confidence or thereabouts if without provenance.

PS I hate that you were deceived.


I will do so - it purports to have come from the Jerry Egeland / Yoder collection in gallup with 2 certifications including from current owner of mine, Bob Bruccia and an older one I have seen. Sadly it was cheaper than this necklace lol. I knew it was a chance of it not being lander blue on this necklace but felt good I could return if so, so was worth the risk, I appreciate everyone and I will post when I get the buckle.

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I am deleting this comment.

thank you , me too :frowning: lesson learned.